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« Where Three Wesleyans and One Reformed Guy Agree... | Main | Big C, Little c, and Barna’s Metaphorical C(c)hurch. »

Saturday, January 28, 2006

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» Church And/Or Community from Blogotional
Those with a vested interest in the church will tell us that we should stick it out no matter how bad things get - but frankly, I have seen some legitimately intoelerable situations. The marriage analogy is overused, and underappreciated. Marriage... [Read More]

» Bolsinger on Barna.... from rhettsmith.com
Tod Bolsinger has some great posts on George Barna's new book Revolution. His post today on Trinity, Community and Church is a great one. Bolsinger says: Since God is a Trinity, the essence of God is loving relationship, best understood... [Read More]

» Bolsinger on Barna.... from rhettsmith.com
Tod Bolsinger has some great posts on George Barna's new book Revolution. His post today on Trinity, Community and Church is a great one. Bolsinger says: Since God is a Trinity, the essence of God is loving relationship, best understood... [Read More]

Comments

Zema Chambers

Thanks, Todd, for your posts. I'm reading with great interest. I'm still wondering how large groups can really consider themselves "church" when the relational things I read here are seemingly not possible in groups larger than about 25. Again, thanks for your writings.

Derek Simmons

Amen, Tod, and Amen. Especially to the part "It’s not just being friends or living in the same housing development. It’s about sharing more than a cup of sugar and the lawn mower, but core values and a vision for living."

I look forward to your discussion of Barna in the context of us in the PCUSA and our need within the PCUSA to share Biblically mandated core values and Christ's vision for living.

Your PITA Brother in Christ,
Derek
Calcitrantes nates ad Dei gloriam

James

I agree with your statements, and as one who is affiliated with the baptists; myself and pastors and ministers I know all recognize that individualism is one of the greatest problems that the church needs to face today.

If all 'church' is to many people is a gathering of individuals there to be coddled and uplifted as individuals then the church cannot function as it is supposed to. I always summarize it this way: when cells in a human body begin to function as individuals apart from the normal function of the body, it develops cancer and becomes unhealthy. Individualism in the church is really no different than that analogy.

Anyways, I wrote a post about what I wished the church on this earth looked like, and some of you may want to check it out.

Go to http://www.discipleofchrist.net/a-countless-multitude

Tod

Derek,
That's a different set of posts for me.

Tod

Mark Daniels

"Christian Community is an ontologically irreducible organism. It is a living reality that is imbued with the Spirit of God. And most dramatically, it is the very life of the Triune God drawing people into a covenantal relationship with God and each other. It is God’s own being on earth lived in and through believers for the single end-result of seeing each person become like Jesus Christ."

As usual, a wonderful post, Tod. But this is particularly right on, a homerun hit from your theological sweet spot. You've well described the sacramental community. I've linked already to your series. But I just had to come back and tell you what a great job you're doing in this response to Barna's work.

Blessings to you, Tod!

Mark

Gordon Cloud

Good post. The Epistle of I John describes koinonia as a fellowship that is based upon a shared belief in Christ. I think your post has done an excellent job of describing what that fellowship should look like.

john alan turner

Tod,
Community is the word in favor right now. Formerly, the word was "fellowship", but that's come to mean something trite -- as in "food, fun and fellowship". Semantics aside, the words mean something much deeper than we sometimes want them to mean. It's more than the warm and cozy place where everybody knows your name. It's got be a place where you're encouraged AND challenged. That makes it a place that is essential (as in "of the essence") to a Christian's life.

Thanks for this post. I look forward to seeing what's next.

David M. Smith

"But we have been so steeped in individualism that we forget that even the Lone Ranger had Tonto. We naturally believe that the very essence of humanity is the individual will. Truly understanding who God is, is absolutely necessary to understanding who we are and who we are meant to become."

Hi Tod,

Sometimes when reading your pieces on community, I get a mental picture of soup where ingredients are blended to make something wonderful. I don’t completely disagree with this concept of community, but I also think the Biblical ideal of Christianity is more of a community of individuals who have maintained individual identity. The Body of Christ should be more like a machine where each part has a specific function and together it accomplishes a purpose. A piston is not a crankshaft and a steering wheel is not a brake. Blending a piston, a crankshaft, a steering wheel, and a brake does not make a car. However, attaching a piston to a crankshaft is the beginning of a car.

It seems to me that the best Christian community will be a community where individualism is honored, not a community where individualism is suppressed and dishonored. I know individualism can go to far, but so can conformity. Perhaps there would be less dissatisfaction with Church if individuals felt more welcome.

Pastor Bong Baylon

Hi, Tod. I am a pastor serving in the Philippines. I came across your blog while browsing and looking for images. I came across the image of the trinity which you posted. I've seen it before in a book I've read about community also. I'm really passionate about community especially in the church context. I would like to learn more. Do you have any of your used books that I can buy? I'm not very rich and I cannot buy brand new books because they are so expensive. One dollar now costs us 44 pesos! If you have any of your used books available, I would love to buy them so I can learn from you. Thanks.

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